All within the context of talking about Race in the MCU. Sooo.

get out of the fandom bobby that's where the crazy lives

well, i mean, not LITERALLY a nazi who DEFINITELY shot a dog, but ESSENTIALLY a nazi who PROBABLY shot a dog. now what he definitely did was murder a lesbian.

what i've never understood is the part where fandom feels the need to defend him or absolve him of this shit because they like him. why? just like him. like him as-is. can't you just have a problematic fave?

I think there was this need of like, a redemption arc that never happened which was so bizzare to me as more and more facts piled on.

i'm always unapologetically like "my magical nazi who murdered everyone you love, she is my queen, how fierce" about bellatrix. 0 fucks and excuses made.

Because the part of the fandom who wants ~redemption~ is usually the part of the fandom that can't separate characters from real people?

and they think that if they like a horrible character, then THEY must be horrible people

even though that's not how fiction works? I think that the young fanbase has some real trouble handling shades of gray

either MY PERFECT FAVORITE or MUSTACHE-TWIRLING EVIL

even though at this point absolutely everyone in AoS is a murderer

even the cinnamon roll science babies

may appreciates the pattern of fitz's murders where he's got her back.

i am cuted out over here whenever the Brain saves the Muscle.

"I have arbitrarily decided you're a bad person and so it's okay to shoot you!" yes, that's exactly how morality works. :|

Simmons was all up for straight up murdering Ward.

Like, up and ready for it.

shot his corpse in the gut and gloated about it later

Not without justification because, you know, Ward but still.

Or at least her version of justification.

and that's where the slope gets slippery

Hunter straight up went on a war path for him. So..Yeah, everyone's killed everyone. Though, I think Coulson's the only one who did it when he did'nt reeeeeally need too?

Coulson's the one who killed people when the SERIES decided it was a bad idea

Yeah. That's a fair way to frame that.

but how many times have there been random run'n'gun scenes where there are lasers going everywhere and Hydra dudes are dropping left and right?

Though, i think that's more because it was very clearly vengeance compared to a mission or self defense.

I'm killing you because you killed my girlfriend.

The motivation was the morally gray area of it all.

well yeah, but at that point literally everyone had that motivation

anyway in the context of race in the mcu ahaha i am so disappointed in people. same people who said "grant ward deserved better" say "just something about luke cage i don't like".

oh gee i wonder what?

oh that's uncomfortable

this attitude of "we must protect the endangered white guy there are so few of him now and he is beset on all sides."

There was an article that was like "Luke Cage is the weakest Neflix Series and I did'nt enjoy it" by this white guy. And I was like "Um..."

"i stopped watchin when i realized they're proving some kind of point with the casting and won't cast any more white people." - actual cancer comments from the AoS facebook page.

Well I mean. You don't have to like everything

I frequently think AoS is hot garbage for reasons that have nothing to do with race

these gracious racists (great band name) put up with so much, but no johnny blaze was the last fucking straw! the last!

but it's that attitude that like. "If I don't like this thing, then it must be objectively bad"

THAT'S where fandom trips over itself

yeah i was like: there are a lot of great reasons to drop this hot mess but the perceived lack of white people is not one of them.

I'm not saying you can't criticize something for legitimate reasons, because, hey, you can, even something like LG but there's literally people complaining about the representation of white people in Luke cage.

It's like complaining that Jessica Jones had too many female cast members, why telling a very female driven story. You sort of...lose any back up for any other arguments you make?

Even the more legitimate arguments.

I have trouble wrapping my brain around those critiques even existing

like. There are whole genres

there's a CHANNEL for "black entertainment"

"chick flicks" that have no men in the cast

why can't comic-based media be just as genred?

I don't get it

Because, and I have to generalize here, being a white, male myself. It's the same reason some guys can't wrap their head around actual female fans of games or movies. It's not something you've ever been told-

Should happen?

there are always minor characters who aren't faultless representations of race. because you can't expect incidental faces to be well fleshed out/representative. anyway. it wasn't spike lee bad.

So you have one media that's catered to you your entire life, and any sudden change like that makes it seem like...your losing it?

asians get shit on in their 5-second one-line speaking roles in almost everything but that complaint goes unheard most of the time.

Well you either like him as a problematic fave and get messages in your tumblr inbox telling you to kill yourself or you silently hope for a redemption arc that never comes and get made fun of so.

what gives white people the special right to hurt feelings here?

Damned if you do damned if you don't.

And we're ona different conversation now anyway. peace out.

Oh, nothing gives white people to get the right to feel hurt.

Or straight bullshit gamers who do the same thing when gay things happen.

You okay, Liz?

It's just this bizzare reaction to "no. This is my thing."

yeah, liz? you know me. i'm not angry at people who want/wanted things i didn't. i'm against fan entitlement. i'm also against "this is THE TRUTH about canon, accept it or kill yourself."

doesn't matter what anyone thinks "THE TRUTH", it's just a show, up for audience interpretation, we can't/shouldn't force our interpretation on anyone.

Pretty much. It's the Fan Entitlement that holds up Ward and shits on POC characters.

but! it's only kind of a different conversation. everything is connected is this way where i feel like ward was so well loved and unconditionally protected in a way that only attractive white man can be.

people who loved him were crazy and people who hated him were - ding ding ding - crazy. but people sure gave a shit, lucky him.

luke cage is the "worst" netflix series in the same way that lemonade is the "worst" beyonce album. (before you share that opinion, maybe consider if there's some part of it you're not getting/not for you.)

that's the checking i tried to do. "cool well this is covering some politicized issues in the country it depicts. this part will mean more for other people than it does for me."

okay maybe it is two different conversations. i'm going back and forth on that myself. i don't know if it's related.

i've heard too much "daisy is boring, bring back ward". i'm bitter enough to suspect a link between "i care more about white people" and "redeem grant ward" but it obviously can't be true of everyone always.

i don't know shit. i don't even go here. i just have a lot of feelings. i wish that i could bake a cake made out of rainbows and smiles.

i know it is not inherently racist to like or defend a character (even a character who is often accused of being a nazi). i just get so tired of hearing the same unexamined opinions over and over.