it's me, one of three virgil stans on the internet (not devil may cry variety)

i adore

(aeneia also can represent)

anyway I don't think I convinced anyone of the value of latin poetry but I do think she was persuaded not to vote for Bloomberg

& that is probably more important on balance

yeah i think you won the ultimate battle there

amor vincit omnia

a small loss for a greater victory

also just to prove i'm not the most insufferable person on the face of the planet I was revisiting the deranged Ed Champion blogpost after reading the latest Emily Gould gawker retrospective, and like

who would do this

also it probably bugs him that everyone knows who "Publius" is b/c of Hamilton

but really why would you ever brag about this in a blog post takedown of a more successful person

do not want to read a catullus rebuttal to my grandmother

hahah I will have to ponder this more

this is the kind of content I appreciate in my plurk replies, though.

I think I can kind of get behind the “Roman Kanye” concept

man reading gould’s essay just gutted me

there are definitely some heartbreaking lines in there

this plurk was a journey

like the aenid which leguin's lavinia made me reluctantly interested in

there are a lot of things to respond to in here

like fuck that bullshit publius man it's 2020 if your style guide doesn't account for chosen names it needs updating

it's also a stupid reference

as an expert in classical pseudonyms

to come back to this Hamilton chose the name Publius in reference to Publicola, a figure associated with, specifically, the founding of the Roman Republic and falsely accused by his enemies as wanting to re-establish monarchy

which was something the constitution's detractors generally accused federalists of

so, if you understand the reference, you also understand the position of the argument

no one is accusing a random dude at a party of wanting to re-establish the monarchy

I suppose since Publius took an anti-Bill of Rights stance he might be signalling distaste for the First Amendment & unfettered freedom of the press? but in fact, I believe he was just signalling that he knows who wrote the Federalist Papers to no apparent end except to look v smug on a blog post.

I didn't link the blog post because it's full of gross misogyny

but you can google emily gould + ed champion to relive the drama

I had blocked all this from my memory

maybe he's referencing how hamilton never knew when to shut up

Hamilton did choose more obscure pseudonyns deliberately to be a pretentious jerk

Hence "Publius" instead of like, Cato or Cincinnatus

I constantly think about elizabeth warren calling hamilton an elitist in the hamilton documentary

I haven't seen this but it's 100% fair

what's funny is she didn't say it on account of his intellectual snobbery but bc he represented the interests of the banks

also true

he was an elitist in multiple dimensions

I do think it's a bit much to hold a 1790s guy responsible for the failures of capitalism

but I also think that chutzpah is very much in the spirit of alexander hamilton

i think it is fair to say that hamilton's vision of both the republic and the economy deliberately concentrated power in the hands of a few, that this was a worthwhile goal to him, while at the same time ofc he had no notion of things like… surveillance capitalism

but when in the hamilton musical it mentions that hamilton proposed "his own form of government" at the constitutional convention it neglects to mention that this form of government was basically elected monarchy

i'm not even sure I'd call the founding fathers or that generation of politicians capitalist on the whole, but hamilton specifically, yes, definitely pro-capital without being pro-labor

he's a problematic fav

oh yeah I mean to say, he had an idea of brilliant individuals who should be in charge of everything but that wasn't what she was calling him out on lmao

and also it's like, he was very much concerned with curbing the power of jefferson's guys and the south so like

anyway I don't think he would have been totally opposed to banking regulations considering his intense faith in the federal government altho he'd probably wring his hands a lot about economic growth

tbh I would pay to see warren and hamilton trying to hash together a workable economic plan even tho I'd only understand about 2/3 of it

anyway sorry this plurk is about hamilton now

was he? concerned with curbing the power of 'Jefferson's guys'?

it depends what you mean by that, I guess, but he wasn't moved by an animus towards the slave power

well yeah I don't just mean abolitionism which was a factor but also that jefferson was against his push for centralization and federalization

I would argue Hamilton wasn't an abolitionist, and while it's true he was for a more centralized government that wasn't based in geographic factionalism

I would have to do some more reading to clearly speak as to hamilton's motives,

now I am running late which is another thing to hate jack publius man for

hahah

basically, I believe that most pro-centralized government feeling in the wake of the American revolution came about from people who served in the army and total clusterfuck of that experience

I don't mean to say that federalism-anti-federalism was rooted in geography like rooting for sports teams or whatever, just that jefferson's 'yeoman farmer' schtick was rooted in the economy of the south

since the continental congress lacked power and authority to like adequately provide direction for / payment for said army

if you look at the constitutional convention and how different delegates voted, that's the biggest indicator, whether they served in the army

that's v interesting and sound reasoning!!!

and also james madison was also publius and he was very much part of the virginia aristocracy

the "yeoman farmer" pastoral vision Jefferson had for the country was rooted in his geography I wouldn't disagree with that

but Hamilton died before the cotton gin transformed the plantation economy and the true geographic tensions began over the issue of slavery

and while Hamilton was pro-industry he was also pre-industry, and again, because he died in 1804, he never really got to see that conflict develop.

if Hamilton had lived until the 1830s I think he may very well have become an abolitionist but he did not

so, that's basically my view on it

yeah that's all valid