in general, I've had a hard time getting a good discussion going in online classes. but there's been a portion of people who'll log in and put me on mute so I've gotten used to just talking to like four people routinely

but my in-person classes have been dead. one can be prodded to life if I push a little, but the other one is like lecturing to corpses

in general, the patter is like. "I talk for 15 minutes then open up the floor for conversation and then we hang out for 20 minutes and then I'll moderate as needed"

corpse-class will be SILENT when I try to open the floor, and then I let the quiet sit in the air for a bit and maybe sheepishly move on to try to find something else to connect with

but it's meant that I move through the material too quickly and end up finishing like 20 minutes early

once or twice is fine, but it's every time with this group

but I'm teaching four sections of the same class so I know it's an appropriate amount of material. and some of the compensations I've made for the corpse group has me going over time with the online groups because then there's too much happening

and I don't know how to spark something with them. I've tried the "you know 10% of your grade is class participation, right" threat

I tried the approach of "maybe the material is too hard and I need to explain more Baby"

but I still think they're not even doing the reading, let alone having thoughts about it

I can handle this behavior if it's one or two people, but they have congealed into this mass of apathy staring blearily at me while alternating between sleeping or checking their phones

and I'm like "WHY ARE WE EVEN HERE"

I can handle being treated like a livestreamer in an online environment, but I don't know what to do with it in person

the room is dark, the acoustics are bad, and I'm running out of ideas about how to make this a palatable experience for the next month and a half

for today they had to read an article about the struggle to create a believable AI, with the argument being that an ai requires human creativity and is best when it's just prompting the human conversation partner to continue

so I was like "let's talk to Cleverbot and see how that works"

and in my first group of the morning, they had a great time setting up fake dates and threatening fake violence to this poor ai who kept insisting that it was a human

but with corpse group it was like... passing one-word responses, unable to create any traction.

"how are you?" "fine." "that's cool."

when 20 live humans can't come together to pass the Turing test, I don't know what to do

and my stress levels being where they are, I'm not handling additional frustrations very well. I've been very "WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM ME" for the last two sessions

and THAT'S not helpful

I don't want to get to the point where I start crying after classes - that's a mood that belongs to the ones that are hostile to me, and apathy is not hostility

but I'm not sure how to get them feeling connected to the material

/lies here and melts into the ether

one of my online classes was observed on Tuesday and the feedback I got was basically "Jessica came prepared and tried very hard to get the class to engage with her" and I'm like "....th....anks...?"

do I get points for effort? I don't feel like I deserve points for effort.

I'm also kind of worried about how this might progress if I don't learn to like this group

like it's fine if they don't like me, but if I don't like them then there's a risk that I'll treat them differently

Ugh, I know these feelings. These are the worst feelings.

Shira how do you do it with the babies

I'm feeling like I'm missing something that would have been covered if I had any actual background in pedagogy

it sounds difficult

sorry you have a rubbish group

my first thoughts were 'a talking hat' or 'throw a ball around and whoever has it has to talk' in like the opposite of 'how to make sure no one hogs the discussion' tactics. but I work with 5 and 6 year olds and so my problems are often the very opposite of 'no one is taking part'

also I keep thinking you work with like teens but they are uni/college students aren't they hmmmm

college students are just teens plus

apathy is such a monster though. ugh.

because it's not you, but they are making a choice passive though it might be, maybe because they're young or who knows what their home and school lives were prior to get them there to just not be inclined toward involvement

while you don't want to be negatively affected by that behavior to remain able to feel confident that you are doing and providing

but it's also possible they're feeding off of their own apathy so no one wants to stand out or be different

yeah. and this is post-pandemic so they've spent the last two years experiencing school as something that plays in the background while they do something else

yes that definitely would factor

so its the usual "oh no this is College" on top of a really abnormal end to high school

have you talked to any of them one on one yet or had any opening to have that kind of conversation?

every one on one conversation I've had has been really chill and normal tbh. it's nailing them down to HAVE that one on one which creates the issue

while it is not necessary what you're there For maybe there would be a chance for insight

oof, yeah that's fair

they're just not coming in with the mindset of how to connect. beyond what the phone taps give them

like I was contacting student support services because I have a really active student who freaks out at the idea of reading a long paragraph and I want to try and get him tested and diagnosed. and they were like "oh yeah here's a resource list also BTW there are two students who are very worried about the paper they're writing for you"

and I was like "then why didn't they tell me "

big part of the voice inside my head is going "this is their trauma response"
you are not the trauma of course ! but also all that about school not being an interactive sport for the last couple of years

they're also probably not thinking of it like that either

and yeah, I can see how trauma would play a role

that they can just talk to the professor, not all of them make themselves available or they have the perception that they're not supposed to "bother"

true I cornered one to be like "HEY DO WE NEED TO TALK" and she was like "slfjsjfifjenfns no I just need more time if that's okay I swear it'll be done soon"

a lot of people are just scared to ask for help

and I was like "I don't care when you get it in - what about me makes you think I care about papers happening on time? D:"

even if you wear a sign that says I Am Here To Help

legit

I worry that i might have shut down a healthy conversation today when I was like "HOW DO I GET YOU TO COMMUNICATE". one of the people who DOES talk started vocalizing anxieties about how he wants to have the right answer before he speaks up" and I was like "you're fine, you talk a lot, don't feel targeted by this convo"

but by trying to reassure him did I shut down a productive conversation about imposter syndrome

It's so hard to know what to do in those situations. There are a few things I've done that have helped with classes that just stare, and I can share them with you if you want! Legit some of it is the 'right answer' anxiety, and to try to get around that

I have them write it down first before they share. There are a couple of ways you can capitalize on that once they have an intial response.

Once that's done, if it's on paper you can have them swap it with a neighbor, underline something they agree/disagree with and say why. Or just turn/share and talk.

Then from sharing in their small groups/neighbors, I can start discussion by, like, 'Share one thing. Did anyone have something similar that agreed/disagreed' ect. It's like pulling teeth but it gets done.

Also, gallery walks and use of sharing technology. Have you ever used jamboards/nearpods/peardeck?

It really sucks bc you are, especially after 2 years of who knows what, legit teaching them how to interact. You shouldn't have to do that, but it's entirely possible that they lack those skills.

If it's just not wanting to stand out/Not wanting to engage with the work though... There's only so much anyone can do with that. Small groups that they then have to publicly present something, like a jigsaw puzzle, has been helpful in the past because of the 'not wanting to be ashamed' motivation.

this sounds really hard, and it's so tempting to just shut down and put in the minimum effort for your class who gives no fucks.

"i want to have the right answer before i speak up"

i...am thinking abut this and i also wonder if some of it is rooted in the... ok bear with me while i sort this out in words

the social-internet world of Youths Today (tm) where everything is subject to being wrong always? where you have to already start from a place of "i've researched it and this is the most possible correct statement that i can make and it offends/affects the least amount of people" because

anything you say is so easily taken apart / discredited / used to create a feeling of shame by your peers OR strangers

and the loudest backlash tends to get the most clout?
i hope i am making sense

sort of "anything you say can and will be used against you" but at a constant level

I hate when this happens but the “20% of your grade is participation” threat has always worked for me as a last resort. I wouldn’t know what to do if it didn’t, either, especially with the sane material working fine in other classes